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post #1 of 38 Old 02-14-2017, 06:30 AM Thread Starter
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Ticking noise at cold startup

Cheers guys, so I know this has probably already been discussed here but I did not find a thread with the information I need. So the problem is the following: When the vehicle has sat overnight for example and I cold start it in the morning I hear 1 to 2 seconds rattle from the engine as the startup RPMs rise. 1 to 2 second later the rattle is gone. I changed my oil two days ago with Valvoline Synpower 5W-40 and used Mobis original Hyundai oil filter as I know that using a different filter can cause such symptoms. However, today morning I heard the rattling noise again at cold startup. The car has been like that for months and no other noticeable problems have occured. My Grandeur (Azera) 3.3v6 used to do this when I had it couple of years ago and I drive it like this without problems. So is this a Hyundai V6 thing or there is a concrete reason for the cold start short rattle? I am starting to think that this symptom has to do with the camshaft chains and the chain guides on them. If some of you remember, couple of months ago I posted a thread with one of the camshaft chain guides missing the rubber part. Well this has been replaced. Any helpful opinions and ideas especially from people who managed to solve this issue will be appreciated. Thank you!

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post #2 of 38 Old 02-14-2017, 09:13 AM
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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

I can see you live in Bulgaria.
Temps seems to be very very low nowadays.

Think you need to try a more thin oil, such as 0W30.
Keeps 5W40 for summer temps.

What is the engine mileage ?
You used a Mobis oil filter before ?

If not, maybe your lifters has been worn by the low pressure because of not using the proper filter.

Try a flush, with seafoam for example, and change oil with thin oil like 0W30 for cold temps

Remember that the Delta V6 engine has very very low bearings clearance, meaning that a thick oil is not necessary and may be bad by clogging oil flow, even if you drive it hard.
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post #3 of 38 Old 02-14-2017, 09:17 AM
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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

1) Stick with OEM viscosity oil. 5W40 is too heavy on the high temp range.
2) IMHO Valvoline is craptastic, try another brand like Castrol or Mobile 1. Heck even Walmart stupertech is better.
3) Is the car parked on an incline over night? That can tend to create low suction scenarios for the oil pump pick up.
4) How many miles on the Tib? Another issue could be failing lifters and/or the ghettofab chain damper plastic thingy in one or both of the heads has disintegrated and could be clogging up some drain back holes.

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post #4 of 38 Old 02-14-2017, 12:52 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

Quote:
Originally Posted by AfterGlow93 View Post
I can see you live in Bulgaria.
Temps seems to be very very low nowadays.

Think you need to try a more thin oil, such as 0W30.
Keeps 5W40 for summer temps.

What is the engine mileage ?
You used a Mobis oil filter before ?

If not, maybe your lifters has been worn by the low pressure because of not using the proper filter.

Try a flush, with seafoam for example, and change oil with thin oil like 0W30 for cold temps

Remember that the Delta V6 engine has very very low bearings clearance, meaning that a thick oil is not necessary and may be bad by clogging oil flow, even if you drive it hard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmdicks View Post
1) Stick with OEM viscosity oil. 5W40 is too heavy on the high temp range.
2) IMHO Valvoline is craptastic, try another brand like Castrol or Mobile 1. Heck even Walmart stupertech is better.
3) Is the car parked on an incline over night? That can tend to create low suction scenarios for the oil pump pick up.
4) How many miles on the Tib? Another issue could be failing lifters and/or the ghettofab chain damper plastic thingy in one or both of the heads has disintegrated and could be clogging up some drain back holes.
Ok guys, firstly I do not agree with saying Valvoline is crap oil simply because it is not! I changed it two days ago, before I had Mobil 3000 5W40 in there, same thing was happening. In fact some Valvoline oils are way better than Mobil or Mobil 1, they have been laboratory tested, you can check results in internet. Secondly, if you look in Hyundai Coupe 2.7 v6 2003 manual it clearly states that 5W30 and 5W40 can be used also 10W30 and 10W40 is ok. Might be different with the US Tiburons manual I do not know. MOST IMPORTANT WHEN COLD 5W30 AND 5W40 BEHAVE IN THE EXACT SAME WAY BECAUSE THEY ARE BOTH 5W! 5W40 BECOMES A BIT THICKER AT HOT TEMPERATURE, BUT AFTER SOME MILES VISCOSITY ALWAYS GOES DOWN AND IT CAN REACH EVEN 5W30 GRADE. I have used Castrol, Mobil, Valvoline, etc. believe me it all is almost the same s...t additives in the oil are different which I can agree is important. As long as you stick with what is written in the manual as viscosity and ACEA A3/B4; API SM, SN/CF; standard you should be fine with your tiburons. 10W-30 and 10W40 are thicker oils that I have not tried maybe they will quiet things down who knows have not tried them. But 5W-30 or 5W-40 is not thick at all and this is why I am 90% positive it is not the oil. My Coupe has 174000 km a.k.a around 108 000 miles. MOBIS gentlemen is the official and only I repeat only original manufacturer of Hyundai parts straight from South Korea. You can not go wrong with Mobis, there is nothing more original than that company for Hyundai and also KIA.
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post #5 of 38 Old 02-14-2017, 12:57 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

Your all Hyundai cars come with Mobis parts straight from the factories in South Korea. It is the only licensed and official manufacturer of Hyundai and Kia parts. I hope this is helpful information.

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post #6 of 38 Old 02-14-2017, 01:28 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

I imported the car from Switzerland and it has full service records in the service book. The last time the vehicle was serviced there they used Liqui Molly 5W-40 and climate between Switzerland and Bulgaria is similar, so I just continued with the same viscosity after I consulted the owner's manual of course.

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post #7 of 38 Old 02-14-2017, 01:51 PM
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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

Whoah....simmer down now...that's why I said IMHO...I've been a member of this site since 02 and am older than most on this forum and have been digging into engines since before most were born on this forum. So if you say some other internet forum says Valvoline is fine then go for it. lol.

And yes depending on your climate the manual may specify a different viscosity range. How many miles (km) were on the Tib before you got it? When was the last time the Timing belt was done? Have you peaked under the valve covers yet to see the condition of things?

I still maintain it could be a failing lifter or lifters. Heck it could even be a failing fuel injector.

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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

i have seen this caused by lifters draining down or excessive cam bearing clearance will also cause low oil pressure at start ups. either way it's not a huge deal to worry about but you could try running a engine cleaner at your next oil change and make sure to use the O.E. oil filter or better.
MY Dad used to add a bottle of atf to his engine a week before his oil changes and swore that it kept the motor super clean inside but I've never had to drive a car 400,000 miles either.
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post #9 of 38 Old 02-14-2017, 02:21 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

Quote:
Originally Posted by HyundaiCoupe2.7V6 View Post
Your all Hyundai cars come with Mobis parts straight from the factories in South Korea. It is the only licensed and official manufacturer of Hyundai and Kia parts. I hope this is helpful information.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmdicks View Post
Whoah....simmer down now...that's why I said IMHO...I've been a member of this site since 02 and am older than most on this forum and have been digging into engines since before most were born on this forum. So if you say some other internet forum says Valvoline is fine then go for it. lol.

And yes depending on your climate the manual may specify a different viscosity range. How many miles (km) were on the Tib before you got it? When was the last time the Timing belt was done? Have you peaked under the valve covers yet to see the condition of things?

I still maintain it could be a failing lifter or lifters. Heck it could even be a failing fuel injector.
Don't get me wrong I am not underestimating your knowledge nor your experience. Which oil brand is better is a continuous debate over many different forums, blogs, websites etc. lets just leave it as a matter of personal preference. I will tell you something that you probably do not know for the simple reason that you live in America and over there is a whole different world. The counterfeited brands in Europe and Eastern Europe are Castrol, Mobil, Elf, Motul and some other ones. You nailed it they are the most popular and used ones, hence they are the most counterfeited ones. Valvoline on the other hand is American and not so popular here, thus no counterfeit products. Why do you say Valvoline is bad? I say it is good because it gets the job done better than many others. Laboratory tests prove it, not some forums or websites.
Anyways, the Tib had 165 000 km when I bought it. I have done the timing belt, water pump, tensioner, pulleys and all fluids and filters when I got it less than a year ago. I have not only peaked under the valve covers but I have also replace the rocker gaskets and one camshaft timing chain guide. You may be right about the failing lifter or lifters. Fuel injectors seem to be alright, the car drives well and accelerates fast. I have advanced car diagnostic tool Autocom + and I have performed numerous diagnostic tests on the vehicle all parameters seem to be in order. I have also switched every single cylinder on and off while the car is running and all lead to the same effect on idle and performance. Not working fuel injector will lead to other symptoms and possibly difficult starting, not the case.

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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

Thank you for your input.

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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

Now why didn't you lead your post with all that very useful information.

To double check the injectors you can get a long metal rod and place it on each injector while the engine is running and see if any sound different. It may not always present itself as a performance problem.

Only real way to check the lifters is to follow the repair manual and check each valve's lifter to cam lobe clearance.

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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

Quote:
Originally Posted by dmdicks View Post
Now why didn't you lead your post with all that very useful information.

To double check the injectors you can get a long metal rod and place it on each injector while the engine is running and see if any sound different. It may not always present itself as a performance problem.

Only real way to check the lifters is to follow the repair manual and check each valve's lifter to cam lobe clearance.
Thank you! Checking the lifters will be heck of a lot of work lol .

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post #13 of 38 Old 02-14-2017, 04:53 PM
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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

I will only add one thing. An injector can be working, but rather loud as well. Sometimes in a OHC engine, lifter/cam noise can be confused with Injector noise as well as the other way around.
Sometimes you can pinpoint the sound enough to determine which it is, but sitting in the car is not a way to do
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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie-III View Post
I will only add one thing. An injector can be working, but rather loud as well. Sometimes in a OHC engine, lifter/cam noise can be confused with Injector noise as well as the other way around.
Sometimes you can pinpoint the sound enough to determine which it is, but sitting in the car is not a way to do
Charlie-III but wouldn't a faulty injector also cause other issues apart from the cold starting noise? An update though, today morning cold started the car and Ohhhh god quiet as hell. So it seems that the crappy Valvoline oil might be up to something I am driving with it for 4 days already and I guess some improvement can be observed, but it is too early to come to any conclusions. Guys how much engine oil exactly your tibs need to be full of oil. I put in mine 4.3 liters of oil and it shows nearly at the full mark on the oil stick, just slightly below max level. I know tiburons are supposed to need 4.5 liters oil filter included. What are your observations on the quantity needed? Cheers

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post #15 of 38 Old 02-15-2017, 06:50 AM
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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

Quote:
Originally Posted by HyundaiCoupe2.7V6 View Post
Charlie-III but wouldn't a faulty injector also cause other issues apart from the cold starting noise? An update though, today morning cold started the car and Ohhhh god quiet as hell. So it seems that the crappy Valvoline oil might be up to something I am driving with it for 4 days already and I guess some improvement can be observed, but it is too early to come to any conclusions. Guys how much engine oil exactly your tibs need to be full of oil. I put in mine 4.3 liters of oil and it shows nearly at the full mark on the oil stick, just slightly below max level. I know tiburons are supposed to need 4.5 liters oil filter included. What are your observations on the quantity needed? Cheers
The manual of the Tiburons are rotten and they say lot of crappy things right there.
I heard lot of people running thinner oil that the manual specifications, but, if you want to run 5W40, it's your right

Below 0°, 0w30 is the best, and the 40 grade when hot is not necessary as i said before.
You will never break down the lubrification film because you switch between 40 to 30 when hot, and of course u will do better mpg than ever and have a smooth engine.
Sometimes, some are using 0w20, which is not on the manual, and have not broken there car (and have a heavy foot trust me)

The lifters can be noisy, but slightly, the cams also.
For example, mine is doing a weird thing but it's normal, i can hear when i turn it on by cold climate the oil suction in the oil pan that gurgle like bubbles, and it's normal because the pan has been designed like this.

The injectors are noisy passed 100k miles, sometimes before, i never heard a tiburon quiet as a prius, it's a combustion engine, not a electric engine.

I have a tip for you : Fit a CAI and an Exhaust
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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

I did not say faulty, I said loud but working. There are a few reasons for an injector to get loud, does not mean it has failed yet.

To help determine what noise you have, maybe get a helper, and when the engine is cold, open the hood and listen to injectors as the engine is started.
This will take a few mornings to check all injectors as well as cams/tappets.
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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

I am not sure if it is worth all the hustle. I mean car drives perfect, accelerates more than quickly for a 2.7 v6, engine is quiet as hell when idling, stable idle. The same story was with my Hyundai Azera 3.3 v6, this sound was heard only when cold starting for a brief second and believe me I drove all around Europe with in without any issues. I think I am getting a bit paranoid, maybe I should just drive lol
Moreover, it seems that nobody on the forum right now has the same issue as me, so I have to start diagnosing, change parts, money etc. without being sure what the issue is and if there is an issue at all.
Time will tell for sure
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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

Quote:
Originally Posted by AfterGlow93 View Post
The manual of the Tiburons are rotten and they say lot of crappy things right there.
I heard lot of people running thinner oil that the manual specifications, but, if you want to run 5W40, it's your right

Below 0°, 0w30 is the best, and the 40 grade when hot is not necessary as i said before.
You will never break down the lubrification film because you switch between 40 to 30 when hot, and of course u will do better mpg than ever and have a smooth engine.
Sometimes, some are using 0w20, which is not on the manual, and have not broken there car (and have a heavy foot trust me)

The lifters can be noisy, but slightly, the cams also.
For example, mine is doing a weird thing but it's normal, i can hear when i turn it on by cold climate the oil suction in the oil pan that gurgle like bubbles, and it's normal because the pan has been designed like this.

The injectors are noisy passed 100k miles, sometimes before, i never heard a tiburon quiet as a prius, it's a combustion engine, not a electric engine.

I have a tip for you : Fit a CAI and an Exhaust

Just small correction, the real difference between 5W-30 and 5W-40 apart from the a but higher viscosity when hot of the 5W-40 is also that 5W-30 is designed for outside temperatures up to 30 degrees celsius and 5W-40 is for up to 40 degrees celsius outside temperature. With global warming and summer knocking on the door it gets easily 36-38 degrees celsius sometimes 40 here in Sofia during the summer. So do you guys still think I made the wrong choice with the oil viscosity?

The weird thing you are describing with the gurgles like bubbles from my experience is actually your fuel pump, rather than your oil pump. You normally hear the fuel pump sucking up the petrol it needs to suck up. I never heard my oil pump making any noise and couple of weeks ago here was -18 celsius, so quite cold at least for me.

Injectors can and are noisy I know this.

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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

Guys how much engine oil exactly your tibs need to be full of oil. I put in mine 4.3 liters of oil and it shows nearly at the full mark on the oil stick, just slightly below max level. I know tiburons are supposed to need 4.5 liters oil filter included. What are your observations on the quantity needed? Cheers

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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

Quote:
Originally Posted by HyundaiCoupe2.7V6 View Post
Just small correction, the real difference between 5W-30 and 5W-40 apart from the a but higher viscosity when hot of the 5W-40 is also that 5W-30 is designed for outside temperatures up to 30 degrees celsius and 5W-40 is for up to 40 degrees celsius outside temperature. With global warming and summer knocking on the door it gets easily 36-38 degrees celsius sometimes 40 here in Sofia during the summer. So do you guys still think I made the wrong choice with the oil viscosity?

The weird thing you are describing with the gurgles like bubbles from my experience is actually your fuel pump, rather than your oil pump. You normally hear the fuel pump sucking up the petrol it needs to suck up. I never heard my oil pump making any noise and couple of weeks ago here was -18 celsius, so quite cold at least for me.

Injectors can and are noisy I know this.
The noise i hear is caused by the dry sump oil system. Some are doing, some never do this.
But it's really anoying ...

As i said before, 0w30 for winter till temps reach 25° Celsius
Then, switch to 5w40 for summer
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post #21 of 38 Old 02-16-2017, 09:15 AM
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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

Dry Sump Oil System is something completely different and has no bearing on this topic. lol Google it!!
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post #22 of 38 Old 02-16-2017, 10:03 AM
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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

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Originally Posted by dmdicks View Post
Dry Sump Oil System is something completely different and has no bearing on this topic. lol Google it!!
Wet sump . Don't know why i was think about dry sump when i wrote my reply.

I'll try to make a short video of the noise because it's really strange
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post #23 of 38 Old 02-16-2017, 10:18 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

What about the oil capacity? How much do your tibs need to fill exactly to full mark 4.5 liters, more, less?

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post #24 of 38 Old 02-16-2017, 11:42 AM
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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

4.5 liters is exactly right (4.8 quarts for US guys). At least that's what I have written on a piece of tape on my fuse box in the engine bay
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post #25 of 38 Old 02-16-2017, 12:06 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Ticking noise at cold startup

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4.5 liters is exactly right (4.8 quarts for US guys). At least that's what I have written on a piece of tape on my fuse box in the engine bay
Thank you! It says the same in the manual, but I am asking because I have in mine right now 4.3 liters and it shows very little bellow full on the dipstick. In the big books it is often written that the oil has to be just tiny little bit below max level. Whether this is really important I do not know but this I have read in couple of books. Anyways, do all of you keep their oil level to max?

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