[martinolsen]

20 years ago Kellydood and I went down the Tiburon modified world.... 2 of the fastest Tibs in MN.... Live your dreams guys/gals.... I think of that journey quite often. Money didn't matter I made every penny back and more....

2004 Hyundai Tiburon GT V6 6spd
Stage 3 Alpine Super Charger, AlkyControl alcohol injection, SCAFii fuel tuner, knock kit, 319whp
AirRide Suspension FBSS digital dash control W/remote, Polk MoMo 12"subs and Kenwood 3000amp.

 

[chase206]

Nice! Did you run a reflashed ECU along side your SAFCII by chance? Seems like a lot of ignition timing on the OEM tune for stage 3. Even the stage 2 reflash pulls a lot of in ignition timing compared to OEM.

I've got all the bits to go stage 3 with an alpine kit but the tune is holding me back. I've got a line on an NGM stage 4 reflash that I intend to street tune with but I can't figure out for the life of me if a stage 3 reflash existed or if the stage 3/4 were the same reflash. The web archive hints that NGM sold the same reflash for stage 3 and 4.

 

[martinolsen]

Unfortunately at that time they still did not know how to reflash the computers. So we had to do everything by a fuel tuner and as I mentioned above a J&S safeguard knock sensor system. I blew up three engines in my car my buddy he ended up taking one out finally. If I had to do it over again I wish I would have put pistons and rods in the car. The cast Pistons were just too fragile. I've probably built that thing in my head a thousand times over. We got so good at swapping the engines in the Transmissions that we could do it start to finish in 6 hours

 

[Rushking19]

Unfortunately at that time they still did not know how to reflash the computers. So we had to do everything by a fuel tuner and as I mentioned above a J&S safeguard knock sensor system. I blew up three engines in my car my buddy he ended up taking one out finally. If I had to do it over again I wish I would have put pistons and rods in the car. The cast Pistons were just too fragile. I've probably built that thing in my head a thousand times over. We got so good at swapping the engines in the Transmissions that we could do it start to finish in 6 hours

Kellydood is a name that I haven't heard for a while . Glad to see you back on here it's cool you and him where got to experience when these cars in their prime. Times have change though we found out that getting the tune set up right is the key to keeping these motors alive. E85 and meth injection mostly help , I've seen a few on motors make near 400whp on stock bottom end and last a while. A forged motor definitely would take more abuse and power .

 

[chase206]

Cheers to you guys for being the original pioneers! All that money and effort to blow up a few motors and learn from it. Our understanding of these motors and tuning has come a long ways since NGM shut its doors. The DIY sector is still struggling but I think there's some hope in the near future for us. That 319WHP would have been very safe with the IAT relocated to the lower intake even with pump 93 and without alcohol injection. E85 would be preferred of course, but pump 93 is still do-able with the right tune and charge air temp safeguards. That IAT location before the blower was really unsafe and still blows my mind that both Alpine and NGM recommended that as the location back then. It's still so wild to me that you guys were tuning with piggybacks and 3rd party devices back then. The J&S safeguard does a decent job and all but not being able to set your base ignition table first is relying heavily on the reaction time of that device. The one time it doesn't react in time is when you detonate especially at stage 3. The alcohol injection was definitely your life saver in that case.

It just so happens that I can reflash our ECUs and have a pretty good grasp of the major map structures. I've seen some interesting data on some of the common reflashes in circulation from those days. The thing that really killed you guys tuning on the piggybacks was the transition point between closed loop and open loop. The OEM ECU would enter open loop full load at around 75% throttle so your fuel enrichment on the SAFCII couldn't start before that threshold or your LTFTs would go crazy. The NGM stage 2 tune would enter open loop full load enrichment at about 35% throttle and pulls ignition timing as much as 8 degrees depending on the location of the map you're in.

For example this is what our OEM ignition table and open loop full load TPS trigger point looks like:

This is what the NGM stage 2 ignition table and open loop full load TPS trigger point looks like for comparison:

I think that if you guys had access to this information early on the platform could have gone down as one of the best DIY platforms of the 2000s and could have had way more aftermarket support that lasted much longer than it did. Our Siemens V6 ECU had already existed in one form or another since the mid 90s. I believe the South Koreans already had a lock on this data by 1998-1999 when the 2.5L Sonatas with a simpler version of our 2003 2mbit ECU came into play. That's probably why they were light years ahead of us on this platform.

 

[martinolsen]

Sorry I ramble but here is also a video of some of our races. I recorded most of them because like I said before when I race I'm only throttle on throttle off not much of a modulation guy.(should explaine the 3-4 motors)

Reading your reply has just brought back a flood of nostalgia and memories that I haven't had a chance to pack in a while. We didn't know a lot back then. My savior was Kelly because he was a mechanic by trade and I was just a union corrugated box maker. I know enough to get myself in trouble and had way too much money to get myself into much trouble. Specifically my car and a lot more upgrades and experimenting done then kelly. He was just focused on making a very clean car that was a sleeper and something that he could do a road course with. Mine I really wanted to go flashy I had a mini garage body kit that was supposed to go on and put the air ride kit on. He had to reroute the frame for the suspension to work when I was working on the motor I kept breaking my ring Landings because of exactly what you're saying. I'll call injection was supposed to be the Savior but the problem was I had to be the fastest one on the street and I hated when somebody tried to pass me on a ricer fly by.

I truly believe the fact that it took so long to crack the lock on the ECU and not a lot of findable data really killed the GK model. And when Hyundai decided to come out with the Genesis Coupe I thought oh my God here it is somebody at Hyundai finally pulled their head out of there arse. And then it just seems like the same thing over again underpowered model followed by very little aftermarket support or too slow aftermarket support. Too many Tiburon owners who never upgraded their model to the rear-wheel drive. And then Kia coming out with an underpowered stinger. It just seems to be more of the same this manufacturer could have made a very impressive model that could have gone down in history as similar as the Supra or the RX7. I'm really glad to see that all of these things are out there but these cars are rusting away to nothing and they're just going to be a distant memory similar to a Geo Storm. I know it's such an oddball reference but part of me is always one of them little coops just because 🤣🤣.
I do find myself on the classifieds quite often looking for the unicorn. I've stressed my friendship with Kelly to the max we don't even talk anymore. I was planning on buying his car from him for $10,000 cuz mine's gone somewhere in California I'm sure it got stripped for just the parts and the frame is sitting in a junkyard somewhere I'll have 27,000 miles.... unfortunately Kelly's car needed basically a whole new rebuild and I panicked and pulled out of the deal.
Who knows what the future holds this is just always been a big part of my past not trying to be the high school football player reliving his Glory Days but that's one of the times I had the most fun. Maybe I should start a vlog talking about some of the stories.

 

[Rushking19]

Sorry I ramble but here is also a video of some of our races. I recorded most of them because like I said before when I race I'm only throttle on throttle off not much of a modulation guy.(should explaine the 3-4 motors)

Reading your reply has just brought back a flood of nostalgia and memories that I haven't had a chance to pack in a while. We didn't know a lot back then. My savior was Kelly because he was a mechanic by trade and I was just a union corrugated box maker. I know enough to get myself in trouble and had way too much money to get myself into much trouble. Specifically my car and a lot more upgrades and experimenting done then kelly. He was just focused on making a very clean car that was a sleeper and something that he could do a road course with. Mine I really wanted to go flashy I had a mini garage body kit that was supposed to go on and put the air ride kit on. He had to reroute the frame for the suspension to work when I was working on the motor I kept breaking my ring Landings because of exactly what you're saying. I'll call injection was supposed to be the Savior but the problem was I had to be the fastest one on the street and I hated when somebody tried to pass me on a ricer fly by.

I truly believe the fact that it took so long to crack the lock on the ECU and not a lot of findable data really killed the GK model. And when Hyundai decided to come out with the Genesis Coupe I thought oh my God here it is somebody at Hyundai finally pulled their head out of there arse. And then it just seems like the same thing over again underpowered model followed by very little aftermarket support or too slow aftermarket support. Too many Tiburon owners who never upgraded their model to the rear-wheel drive. And then Kia coming out with an underpowered stinger. It just seems to be more of the same this manufacturer could have made a very impressive model that could have gone down in history as similar as the Supra or the RX7. I'm really glad to see that all of these things are out there but these cars are rusting away to nothing and they're just going to be a distant memory similar to a Geo Storm. I know it's such an oddball reference but part of me is always one of them little coops just because 🤣🤣.
I do find myself on the classifieds quite often looking for the unicorn. I've stressed my friendship with Kelly to the max we don't even talk anymore. I was planning on buying his car from him for $10,000 cuz mine's gone somewhere in California I'm sure it got stripped for just the parts and the frame is sitting in a junkyard somewhere I'll have 27,000 miles.... unfortunately Kelly's car needed basically a whole new rebuild and I panicked and pulled out of the deal.
Who knows what the future holds this is just always been a big part of my past not trying to be the high school football player reliving his Glory Days but that's one of the times I had the most fun. Maybe I should start a vlog talking about some of the stories.

The the lack of ecu tuning definitely hinder the tiburon platform I think Hyundai choosing the Siemens based ecu was a good thing and bad thing , because Siemens based ecus have a lot of features and capabilities but the ecu is harder to tune if you don't have the tuning software. The tuning software has been available for a long time but not many want to share because the legality. Many people in Korea still want 2k for the software. Because what I've heard the software was stolen from Siemens and disturbed around.

 

[The_Evenger]

Many people in Korea still want 2k for the software

I wonder if we could get enough people together for a group buy of the software. I don't know if they have any non-disclosure conditions on purchase, but I'd definitely chip in a few hundred if it meant full control of our ECUs. although who knows what kind of VCI or licensing it requires to work, would suck to have the software registered to a single computer or dongle.

 

[Rushking19]

I wonder if we could get enough people together for a group buy of the software. I don't know if they have any non-disclosure conditions on purchase, but I'd definitely chip in a few hundred if it meant full control of our ECUs. although who knows what kind of VCI or licensing it requires to work, would suck to have the software registered to a single computer or dongle.

Me and another guy talked about If that was possible too a group buy but . Idk how much I'd spend on it because I already have an standalone but it would be cool to see though. I hear that some ecus may be different though but we would have to get the software first to see for sure .