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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I just replaced my clutch (ClutchMasters Fx250) flywheel (Ark) as well as the slave cylinder (and removed the spring) and installed a steel braided clutch line, the car shifts decently ish and everything works, but the pedal feels incredibly soft and my transmission now grinds hard going into reverse, i've tried bleeding 3 separate times, any advice is very appreciated!
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
replaced my master cylinder, now the pedal feels firmer and like a real clutch, but the car still has a hard time going into gear from a stop and it grinds going into reverse (unless you put in a gear and then immediately go into reverse for some reason??) I tried adjusting the pedal as in the pictures below, I adjusted it into all different places on the rod and it wouldn't go into gear at all! I called it quits for the night and when I came back to it the next day it was back to going into gear! (I have the adjustment for the longest possible) still grinding and tough to get it but it goes into gear again, so I am really unsure of what to do now, I have found that the master cylinder I bought from oreillys, the rod is almost a half inch shorter than the OEM one, is that the problem? do I need to buy the OEM master cylinder for that extra half inch on the rod? the pictures above of my slave cylinder, the 1st is at rest, and the other 3 are with the pedal touching the floorboard, that doesn't seem like a lot of movement? is that how much it normally is?
 

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Well, the description on the page really explains itself. But the short story is, this is longer than stock and will allow more travel. The aftermarket cylinders all come with shorter rods than OE which only makes it worse. The other benefit is it gets rid of the plastic part that connects to your pedal. Like you, I had mine adjusted as far as it could go, and actually had the plastic section come apart under pressure while driving. That wasnt fun.

I had already changed the clutch/flywheel with fidanza, and clutchmasters fx350 (was supposed to be 250, but thats another story). I also changed out the shifter bushings with solid ones.

Another problem I was having was after driving for more than an hour, even just running around town, I would lose pedal as if the clutch was worn down (brand new clutch), and only had disengagement at the bottom of the stroke, if at all. If i let it sit and cool down, or bled the fluid again, the problem would go away. This seemed to me to be a heat related issue. I had replaced the master/slave and clutch line with steel braided prior to all this ( I also removed the spring in the slave). So all the components were new. After having bled the system again, after a few weeks, I noticed the fluid was turning black.

Obviously there was some contamination from one of the components, so I also changed the feed line from the reservoir, purchased castrol srf, bought an OE master, and installed the pedal adjuster. two months later, after no further issues, took it to the dragon and had a blast
 

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I bet your master cylinder throw is not adjusted correctly. Judging by the set nut being in the wrong location. If the throw isn't set properly the valve in the master doesn't allow flow back to the master decreasing the distance that the clutch will disengage the next time you apply your clutch pedal.

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Grab a friend and follow the master cylinder setup process outlined by these guys just following the bleeding process in this video:

 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I bet your master cylinder throw is not adjusted correctly. Judging by the set nut being in the wrong location. If the throw isn't set properly the valve in the master doesn't allow flow back to the master decreasing the distance that the clutch will disengage the next time you apply your clutch pedal.

View attachment 137376

Grab a friend and follow the master cylinder setup process outlined by these guys just following the bleeding process in this video:

thanks ill give it a shot, the nut you circled in the picture is the locking nut to keep it tight, not the adjustment nut, although in that picture it adjusted to be as far out as possible
 

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thanks ill give it a shot, the nut you circled in the picture is the locking nut to keep it tight, not the adjustment nut, although in that picture it adjusted to be as far out as possible
Just remember that the rod's throw adjustment isn't like it is on a cable clutch adjustment that can give you an adjustable grab point. The rod's throw adjustment is for the valving inside the master to allow flow in either direction. If it's incorrectly set you will effectively have a one way valve with a rock hard pedal or a soft pedal. Anything in between may work intermittently.

Since it is set to be as long as possible, the valve isn't closing to pump pressure until about 25% or 33% of the clutch pedal distance. That means you have that much less distance to build pressure and fully disengage the clutch. Adjust it with a friend like in the video and you'll get back all the pressure and distance you need to get in and out of gear without any issues.
 
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Just remember that the rod's throw adjustment isn't like it is on a cable clutch adjustment that can give you an adjustable grab point. The rod's throw adjustment is for the valving inside the master to allow flow in either direction. If it's incorrectly set you will effectively have a one way valve with a rock hard pedal or a soft pedal. Anything in between may work intermittently.

Since it is set to be as long as possible, the valve isn't closing to pump pressure until about 25% or 33% of the clutch pedal distance. That means you have that much less distance to build pressure and fully disengage the clutch. Adjust it with a friend like in the video and you'll get back all the pressure and distance you need to get in and out of gear without any issues.
thank you so much, I've been practically ripping my hair out trying to get it back on the road for the past 3 weeks, (i had a bad axle seal and oreillys gave me the wrong part twice before they realized they don't carry the correct seal so i had to order it from the dealer, and then I've had nothing but issues with this since then) I will most definitely give it a shot! thank you again!
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Just remember that the rod's throw adjustment isn't like it is on a cable clutch adjustment that can give you an adjustable grab point. The rod's throw adjustment is for the valving inside the master to allow flow in either direction. If it's incorrectly set you will effectively have a one way valve with a rock hard pedal or a soft pedal. Anything in between may work intermittently.

Since it is set to be as long as possible, the valve isn't closing to pump pressure until about 25% or 33% of the clutch pedal distance. That means you have that much less distance to build pressure and fully disengage the clutch. Adjust it with a friend like in the video and you'll get back all the pressure and distance you need to get in and out of gear without any issues.
Well I gave it a shot, I can't find the point where the valve closes and I can't push the slave back, so I instead tried every position on the rod... None of them work, not sure why I can't find the point where the slave doesn't push back, any ideas?
 

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Could be a faulty or incorrect master cylinder if you're unable to push back on the slave. The valving or rod may not be correct. Do you happen to have a photo of both the new and old master cylinders?

I replaced my master cylinder which was slightly different than the OEM for my V6/6Speed from a cheap "OE" manufacturer. I tried it regardless thinking it was a different design revision or part update but I could never get it to work right. I decided it was likely from a V6/5Speed or L4/5Speed and tossed it out. Never figured out why it was different though. I ended up sourcing a used OEM master cylinder and it solved my problems.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Could be a faulty or incorrect master cylinder if you're unable to push back on the slave. The valving or rod may not be correct. Do you happen to have a photo of both the new and old master cylinders?

I replaced my master cylinder which was slightly different than the OEM for my V6/6Speed from a cheap "OE" manufacturer. I tried it regardless thinking it was a different design revision or part update but I could never get it to work right. I decided it was likely from a V6/5Speed or L4/5Speed and tossed it out. Never figured out why it was different though. I ended up sourcing a used OEM master cylinder and it solved my problems.
sorry I should've worded better, i cannot find the point where I can't push the slave cylinder back, I'm always able to push back on the slave, sure I'll get some photos of the oem one and the new oem i just bought
 

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Try shortening the rod adjustment as far as you can to see if it stops letting you push it back in. Infact is there ever a point while slowly pressing down on the clutch where it stops? That's a good indicator of how far you need to shorten the rod. If there is no point which it stops then you may have a faulty or incorrect master cylinder.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Try shortening the rod adjustment as far as you can to see if it stops letting you push it back in. Infact is there ever a point while slowly pressing down on the clutch where it stops? That's a good indicator of how far you need to shorten the rod. If there is no point which it stops then you may have a faulty or incorrect master cylinder.
ill try that, do you mean by "where it stops" as in when im pushing down the pedal the slave cylinder stops extending yet i have more room to push farther?

also thank you again so much, you're a massive massive help
 

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There should be a point while pressing down on the clutch pedal where you won't be able to push back on the slave cylinder because the valving inside the master cylinder is only allowing flow in one direction. On a normally functioning car that should be within about 0.25" from the top of the pedal location. If you have to push on the clutch a fair amount before it blocks reverse flow from the slave cylinder this is a good indicator it's the wrong master or could be damaged. Could also be an indicator it was never bled properly.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
There should be a point while pressing down on the clutch pedal where you won't be able to push back on the slave cylinder because the valving inside the master cylinder is only allowing flow in one direction. On a normally functioning car that should be within about 0.25" from the top of the pedal location. If you have to push on the clutch a fair amount before it blocks reverse flow from the slave cylinder this is a good indicator it's the wrong master or could be damaged. Could also be an indicator it was never bled properly.
Wait your saying when I'm pushing the slave back to see if the valve is closed I should have someone press on the clutch pedal during that time? That's not what I understood from the video and would make sense as to why I can't find that point
 

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Try shortening the rod adjustment as far as you can to see if it stops letting you push it back in.
I made a mistake with this advice. I meant that you should adjust the rod longer until the slave stops pushing in. Then you shorten it one to two turns so that you can push back on the slave to return fluid back to the master reservoir.

Essentially you have a variable one way valve in the master cylinder. You want to adjust that master cylinder rod so that the valving allows flow back to the master reservoir with the pedal all the way up in it's resting position. You may have to lift the pedal by hand or foot to it's resting position if the clutch isn't resetting it's position for you. You want the valving the block that flow with about 0.125-0.25" of pedal travel so that pressure builds to disengage the clutch when fully pressed to the floor. If the master rod adjusted too long, the valving will block flow back to the master reservoir at the pedals resting position preventing clutch engagement when the pedal is released. Then if it's adjusted too short it may build pressure too late in the pedal travel to be effective enough to disengage the clutch. There is a fine line of adjustment where it needs to be to function properly.

Wait your saying when I'm pushing the slave back to see if the valve is closed I should have someone press on the clutch pedal during that time? That's not what I understood from the video and would make sense as to why I can't find that point
You don't want to press on the clutch pedal while you are doing the procedure from the video for the final adjustment. What I proposed is as a simple test to see if you have a point at all in the pedal travel where the master valving prevents you from pushing the slave rod in. IE if the master rod is adjusted to the shortest or longest and you can still push the slave rod in... then have someone softly press on the clutch pedal until the valving in the master prevents you from pushing on the slave rod in. If the distance you have to push the pedal is significant like 50% pedal travel, there is no amount of adjusting the master rod that will fix this and you should look into obtaining another master as a last resort.
 
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I dont want to get in the middle of your advice here, but id like to point out that this is easily felt in the pedal with free play before it builds pressure. Brake master cylinders are a little trickier, but being that this is a clutch master, there is only one feed port, and one exit port. The pedal cant/wont build pressure until the cup passes the feed port.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
I made a mistake with this advice. I meant that you should adjust the rod longer until the slave stops pushing in. Then you shorten it one to two turns so that you can push back on the slave to return fluid back to the master reservoir.

Essentially you have a variable one way valve in the master cylinder. You want to adjust that master cylinder rod so that the valving allows flow back to the master reservoir with the pedal all the way up in it's resting position. You may have to lift the pedal by hand or foot to it's resting position if the clutch isn't resetting it's position for you. You want the valving the block that flow with about 0.125-0.25" of pedal travel so that pressure builds to disengage the clutch when fully pressed to the floor. If the master rod adjusted too long, the valving will block flow back to the master reservoir at the pedals resting position preventing clutch engagement when the pedal is released. Then if it's adjusted too short it may build pressure too late in the pedal travel to be effective enough to disengage the clutch. There is a fine line of adjustment where it needs to be to function properly.



You don't want to press on the clutch pedal while you are doing the procedure from the video for the final adjustment. What I proposed is as a simple test to see if you have a point at all in the pedal travel where the master valving prevents you from pushing the slave rod in. IE if the master rod is adjusted to the shortest or longest and you can still push the slave rod in... then have someone softly press on the clutch pedal until the valving in the master prevents you from pushing on the slave rod in. If the distance you have to push the pedal is significant like 50% pedal travel, there is no amount of adjusting the master rod that will fix this and you should look into obtaining another master as a last resort.
ok great I'm understanding this better now, my point earlier was that even when I have the master cylinder rod adjusted as far out as possible, I can still push in on the slave, I can't find the point where that valve closes
 
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