[Falcon_w13]

Hello again!

Today is the day that the tib finally gets a little more love, where im a trying to solve the kdm reflash ecu + safc CEL at WOT. As a few members here have already seen my build come together a couple years ago, here is a little more info from my research and kit development! Hopefully the tuner gods on newTib can help me find a solid solution to my findings.

Since i am still a college student and too broke to fork out more money for a standalone, i have taken the time to research how to really setup and tune with an SAFC-ii. As you might already have a wall setup against the SAFC keep in mind that i do have a reflashed ecu that does know how to respond to boost! In this post i am going to cover the basics and how to really use the SAFC Safely!

Here are my list of mods!

2.0L 2004 MAF to MAP converted Tibby
Precission T3/T4 super 60 (18psi)
Speedfactor Semi-balanced manifold
Full piping and 24x9x3 intercooler

Tigerlily 8.5:1 coated and balanced pistons

60lb Siemens Deka Injectors (630cc at 43.5psi)
255lb Walbro Fuel Pump
Aeromotive Rising FPR 1:1 with a return style fuel system.
(currently setup to a 50 psi + 18psi when in full boost, so max pressure 68psi)

Fidanza light weight flywheel
Clutchnet Stage 3 sprung clutch
ACT Push pressure plate + Conversion Lever

Full Cry02 system
-Fuel bar
-Intake bulb
-Intercooler sprayer

System upgrade 65mm BBTB
Ported and polished Intake manifold

HKS ssqv BOV
Active Autowerke BOV

38mm Tial wastegate
2.5 inch cat-less Exhaust full back
Electronic E-Cutout after down pipe.

KDM SFR Reflash ECU (tuned for 18 psi with a hyundai 2.5 Bar Map - reference)
SAFC II piggyback with a 3bar GM MAP configuration
Zeitronix Wideband Logger System


Pics of my lady! Iphone 4 crap quality but you get the idea.

Here are the initial settings for my SAFC-ii for the gm 3bar map setup. Keep in mind that my ecu was tuned for a 2.5bar map sensor.

cyl - 4
arrow - up
Type of sensor - Pressure
Sensor n0.
in - 14
out - 06

Hi Settings

800 -- -18
1000 -- -15
1600 -- -20
2200 -- -10
2800 -- -10
3400 -- +5
4000 -- +10
4600 -- +20
5200 -- +22
5800 -- +22
6400 -- +23
7000 -- +25

Lo settings
800 -- -15
1000 -- -15
1600 -- -15
2200 -- -18
2800 -- -18
3400 -- -18
4000 -- -18
4600 -- -15
5200 -- -15
5800 -- -15
6400 -- -15
7000 -- -15

WOT Air/Fuel Ratio is 10.4 - 11.2. Cruising AFR 13.2-13.8

This was a first run of the day on the street and i am still getting some problems with high map voltage at 5k rpm plus. I do find this kind of strange as the 3bar should be reading about 3.8-4.0v at 18 psi. High map voltage i guess can be caused by me adding +20% correction but this is a must due to the fuel requirement for safe boosting. Going to change the Sensor n0. to in - 14 and out - 05 and run a retune to see how she likes it. This might solve my high map voltage to the correct parameters.

Tomorrow might be a better day for that as the weather is setting up to rain right now.

Link here for the Zeitronix 4th gear pull to about 4500 rpm. Sensor on the bottom is the map voltage output to the ECU.
Zeitronix Data Log

 

[markstibbyspot]

wth is that?!?

 

[Doomsday Postcard]

where are you hiding the nitrous bottle?!?!

 

[Chuckie]

^^^^ huh? it's right there in the trunk.

 

[schroder]

Why two BOVs?

 

[jeffrey]

How many horsepower does the skateboard and shoes give you? Lol

Back on topic
This car looks pretty good. Repaint those headers

 

[Doomsday Postcard]

^^^^ huh? it's right there in the trunk.

haha i didn't see it when i glanced because of the glare...plus it's mounted the wrong direction...so i guess the glare and wrong position threw me off...
my bad...

 

[Falcon_w13]

Why two BOVs?

Well that is a valid question! first setup i was running just the HKS ssqv and what do you know turbo suffered from compressor surge and blew almost all of the fins off the turbo. i was lucky enough that they got stuck going into the intercooler. Where i could pick all the pieces out before they got stuck in my motor.

I installed a new turbo that i had laying in my closet because i had bought 2 of the same when i started this project.. now i have to send the other one out to get rebuilt.. but my family owns Active Autowerke where i told them about what happened and my uncle sent me a Active BOV and said that if i installed that one with my small ssqv that it would solve my problem! he was right! Now the car sounds sickerrrr and the Active BOV has a 44mm opening compared to the hks about 30mm. its seems the ssqv does not like to open under low boost conditions where the Active bov takes over.

look at this poor turbo! no shaft play or any leakage, barely 20k miles on it!!!

Another tuner run today on my way to work! Let you guys know how it goes!!

 

[TibbyTurnedTuscani]

Can't wait to view this later when I can see the pics (no pics here at work... stupid pic blocker!)

 

[M.Kyle]

38mm Tial wastegate
2.5 inch cat-less Exhaust full back
Electronic E-Cutout after down pipe.

Ugh I'm SO jealous, I want that so bad! haha

And your skate is missing riser pads!
j/k lol
Nice ride man

 

[Falcon_w13]

^^ yea man i have a lot of fun with that e cut out! LOL its so funny people are like OMGWTF! Worth every penny!

And riser pads make it feel weird high! LOL i couldnt stand em so i took em off!

---

Still having problems with fuel and ignition cut at full boost, still cant pass 4k. Still running on the in 14 out 06 on the safc. Its weird when i pull back voltage on the high end the AFR seems to want to stay around 11.2-11.4 which is a little lean for my comfort. But when spooling right before full boost when the map sensor is about at 4.2v-4.3 the AFR is about 10.5. as soon at the sensor hits 4.5-4.6 she leans out like a mother and spikes to 11.4-11.8, there is when the car is pulling timing and cel comes on...

After work going to try to get my full boost to hit 4.2-.4.4v then my AFR should be in check and hopefully the car does not throw as CEL and i may get some smooth power!!! Cross your fingers!!!

 

[Falcon_w13]

Here is a little write up of my findings as i have been trying to figure out these problems with the car throwing a CEL as soon as max boost hits and i get really bad timing and loss of power. alright im going to stop being lazy and do some math! LOL Feel free to check my work and critique what errors you might have found! All help is appreciated!

Here we go!

First off lets start out with what i am assuming.

The ecu was tuned for 18 psi on a 2.5 map sensor. (The 2.5 bar replacement for an 03 tiburon in the IM)
Both map sensors work on a 0 to 5 volt linear scaling method.
1 bar is 14.7 psi

2.5 bar map will read a max 36.75 psi - so 1 psi will give me ~0.136054 volts
3 bar map will read a max 44.1 psi - so 1 psi will give me ~ 0.113378 volts

Under idle conditions on the 3 bar map @ in-14 and out-06 it was pulling about 0.67 volts. That translates to about 5.9psi. <<-- on a 8.5:1 compression ratio. Sound about right?

Now, we know that when a sensor is a 3 bar, its 14.7 psi vacuum and 29.4 psi boost. So at an ambient 14.7 psi the earth regular pressure we get a 1.666v.

Yep you guessed it, Compare that now to the 2.5 bar map sensor and figure out what are percent difference is.

A 2.5 bar map sensor means that it reads 14.7 psi vacuum and 22.05 max psi boost. So at an ambient 14.7 psi the sensor should read 2.0v.

Now the ecu is tuned for a 2.5bar map sensor and having a initial reading for 2.0v. Having my SAFC on the Settings in-14 out 06 the 3 bar map read a 2.01v! This is awesome progress and confirmation that i am on the right track!

Just a little more! The car is tuned for an 18 psi and that would mean the 2.5bar sensor will be reading 14.7+18= 32.7psi at a max voltage 4.4489v. Now here is where i think my problem is, my max voltage is 4.5-4.8, and the ecu is thinking that it is seeing way more boost than it is and pulling timing?. Im not sure what is happening with the injector pulse and duration. Maybe one of the tuner gods know?? Also causing it to run lean? Might be the CEL that is thrown may be making it run in limp mode. As soon as the CEL hits i am out of the throttle for the safety of my motor.

I have setup these values in excel spreadsheet with both the 2.5 bar and 3 bar map and calculated the % difference and it came to be a 16.66%. So that would mean that my base should be at a -16/-17% pull on the safc settings.

^^^^ This is confirmed because my lo settings is at a -15 across. Maybe i need to pull a solid -15% on my hi settings too! This is scary to do all at once so im going to have to pull a little at a time to make sure that my ARF does indeed stay in my comfort zone. Another day of testing or ride to work!

Attached is the spreadsheet with numbers for reference.
Here

 

[Chuckie]

haha i didn't see it when i glanced because of the glare...plus it's mounted the wrong direction...so i guess the glare and wrong position threw me off...
my bad...

Only position that matters is the angling of the neck higher than the bottom.

 

[Doomsday Postcard]

Only position that matters is the angling of the neck higher than the bottom.

NOS bottles come with siphon tubes and, in order to maintain proper nitrous pickup, it is important to mount the bottle correctly. We recommend mounting the bottle at a 15 degree angle with the valve end higher than the bottom of the bottle. The valve end of the bottle should point to the front of the vehicle and the valve knob and label should face straight up.

 

[Jake89]

Can't wait to view this later when I can see the pics (no pics here at work... stupid pic blocker!)

^ I have the same problem. But from the sounds of it the car is beastly! :ninjaman:

 

[bmxer]

Do you have a voltage clamp? You converted from MAF to MAP, but the ECU could be seeing more voltage then it can handle and giving the CEL....

 

[Falcon_w13]

i do not have a map clamp on the car.. the ecu sees real time map voltages generated by the safc. but i know that it will throw a CEL if i pass a 4.7-4.8v but i think that might be a combination of preignition and a knock sensor pickup to force limp mode. I do want to upgrade from the SAFC but it will cost me a lot of money right now to buy the new piggyback and then find someone local to tune it for me. Really not what i can afford right now.

I have already put a lot of money in converting the car to a push clutch system (95-99 non turbo eclipse 2.0L pp). DO not use the Extreme pressure plate from ACT it will break the TOB fork that goes in the tranny. Broke two of them already and switched it to a regular ACT pp and no problems ever since, but $700 later. ( still have that pp btw if anyone wants it!) LOL

 

[tiburon_blanco]

i have a hks ssqv on my car since i turbocharge it...0 broken turbos,0 surge!!!!

 

[Chuckie]

NOS bottles come with siphon tubes and, in order to maintain proper nitrous pickup, it is important to mount the bottle correctly. We recommend mounting the bottle at a 15 degree angle with the valve end higher than the bottom of the bottle. The valve end of the bottle should point to the front of the vehicle and the valve knob and label should face straight up.

I used nitrous oxide pre-fast and the furious movies. It's a bottle with a tube, not a flux capacitor. It's mounted fine. Just for reference...the NOS company guidelines:

If the bottle must be mounted parallel to the axles of the vehicle (sideways), the valve handle and label must be angled at approximately 45° toward the front of the vehicle (Figure 3D). This orientation will position the siphon tube toward the rear of the bottle.

Back to topic, sort of....yes the safc has limitations, but it's better than a fmu....which is what us turbocharging imports on a budget in the 1990's were stuck with.

 

[Tuscani23]

If you dont have money sell the SAFC and buy a MAF TO MAP ECU for $425 at NGM it will just work great for your car.